[WarInEur] Re: Battle of Britain & Sea Lion

[Jeffery K. McGonagill]

It is still a question of what the British/Germans thought at the time.  The players know that historically the Germans had no chance of succeeding, the British didn't.  They had serious concerns about it, even in 1941, until the Germans invaded Russia.  Even then they didn't send a lot of additional forces to Egypt.

The British also have too large a shipping capacity.  Shipping anywhere but France should be limited to 0-2, with 0-1 the most common until at least US Entry.

~Jeffery~


  Because building surface fleet takes YEARS.  

  I suggested years ago using the old Avalon Hill War at Sea as a "Naval Module";  If you want the German Reinforcements, each would require the Purchase (more or less) of a Surface Point.  But the building capacity just isn't there,  Bismarck and Tirpitz (& Graf Zepplin) were already afloat (Launched) in September 1939 (14.2.39, 1.4.39; Graf Zepplin 8.12.38).  The next (plaaned) Battleship, "H" had 1200 tons of Material on the Slipway, "J" "Several Hundred") ((H. T. Lenton, German Warships of  the Second World War, New Tork, ARCO, 1976)  (Handiest Book with that kind of Data).  Look at how slow U-Boat production was to get geared up.  Just building a handful of additional Destroyers, well, NO U-Boat war.  And even they take years to build, the British had started building the Hunt Class (And Flower class corvettes) after Munich.  And like a lot of What Ifs, the Allied response is also "Assumed" in the Game.  British planning for the "River" class Frigates started in November 1940, but the first did not enter service until late 1942.   Destoyers are a much more complicated proposition.

  Amphibious shipping is even worse;  The LST was an Accidental invention of the British Purchasing Commision, and was one of the most important constraints on ALlied Amphibious Planning.   The Germans did not even have the desing experience of experimental prototypes.  There is a fascinating set of pictures of the improvised German amphibious shipping for Sealion in an early issue of Warship,  It is not quite as bood as Bismarcks old Joke about what he would do if the British Launched an Amphibious Invasion (1880's?), but even if the Germans could put the combat elements of two or three divisions ashore in the first echelon, They might be ashore, but with what they could carry on their backs, and a lot of the Shipping was planned for a one way trip.  

  And look at what a cluster F the LANDINGS in Sicily, and Italy (and Anzio) were.  
  (Been reading Rick Atkinson's New Book).

  Or D-Day, and that was with multiple "Lessons Learned".  

  I doubt the German (Or anyones) ability to improvise the Logistics follow on, think the Fallshrimjager in Amsterdam with NO ground releif.  And the British will (would) be throwing everything they have at you.

  Karl Gaarsoe


  Carl Rupp <carlaugustruppsr at aol.com> wrote:
    What if the limit on German surface fleets and amphibious assault units 
    were lifted? Then they would be able to build a decent force for a 
    spring 41 invasion, right? What is the historical logic behind the low 
    limit on there units/counters for the Germans, anyway?

    Carl



    Kent & Sue Haunschild wrote:
    > NONE!
    >
    >
    > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carl Rupp" 
    > To: 
    > Cc: ; 
    > Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 10:00 AM
    > Subject: Re: [WarInEur] Re: Battle of Britain & Sea Lion
    >
    >
    >>> 
    >> *Another email discussed Sea Lion and the low chances of success. If 
    >> the Brits don't commit to France, or successfully pull their troops 
    >> out, what chances do the Germans have with Sea Lion. Even if they 
    >> have the Sea Lion rules and build tons of AP for Sea Interdiction and 
    >> Air Superiority, and invest 100+ arms points into building a invasion 
    >> fleet of surfs and amphibs, can they succeed?
    >>
    >> Carl
    >> *
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
    >>>
    >>> Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape 
    >>> 
    >>> in the new year.
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