[WarInEur] Queries

Mon Dec 17 06:02:00 EST 2007

Kent,

If I understand all the arguments correctly then I disagree, the game is 
only broke if the Soviets can not go to total war due to the proposed 
limitation imposed by the Axis or some type of weird triggers you are 
all discussing. To me these all sound pro-German are and are designed to 
give the Axis player an unfair advantage and are and abuse of the intent 
of the original rules.

The DG RAW are thus:

First from 38.0
 Only the Axis (or in exceptional circumstances the Allied) Player may 
initiate Total War by escalating a Limited War as in 38.1 or attacking 
the Soviet Union at peace.

38.1
 Assuming that the Soviet Player foregoes Limited War and remains at 
Peace, then only an Axis attack upon the Soviet Union precipitates Total 
War.

_8) Soviets go to total war if 1) Axis declare war while Soviets are at 
peace, 2) Axis capture 3 personnel centers while Soviets are at limited 
war, or 3) Allies capture 3 personnel centers while Soviets are at 
limited war, but this can only be done if Rome is Allied controlled._

[45.3] Soviet Production

            At war's start (3/9/39) the Soviet Player has all the arms, 
personnel and training centers enumerated and in place as per S3.6 
(except for Riga, which doesn't become a Soviet Personnel Center until 
the USSR totally occupies Latvia; see 45.52). In other words, the Soviet 
Production apparatus is that described in the Barbarossa Campaign 
Scenario. Beginning with the 0/10/39 cycle, the Soviet Player uses his 
system to increase his armed forces. However, the Soviet Production 
rules describe Soviet Production in a Total War status. Short of Total 
War, Soviet Production is restricted by limiting the number of personnel 
and arms points the Soviet Player may add each cycle to the respective 
Personnel and Arms Pools.

[45.31] Peacetime Production

            If the Soviet Player is at peace he may add only four 
Personnel Points and eight Arms Points to his respective pools each 
Cycle, regardless of the number of operational Personnel and Arms 
Centers he possesses. There is no limit on the number of personnel and 
arms points he may expend in production in any one cycle, only on the 
number of adds to his pools. Except for this organic brake on eventual 
overall production the Soviet Player may build what he likes, subject of 
course to the implicit requirements of 45.2 which require unit-specific 
deployment by 0/5/41 at the latest.

[45.32] Limited War Production Table

            If the Soviet Player is at Limited War, he is limited in the 
number of Personnel and Arms Points he may add to his pools per cycle, 
according to the table given below. The amounts vary with the year in 
question.

Year of Cycle

Personnel Points

Arms Points

1939

5

9

1940

7

10

1941

7

11

1942

8

13

1943

9

15

1944

10

20

1945

10

25

            Note: Prior to Total War the Soviet Player will either be at 
Peace or at Limited War. It is possible that he could alternate between 
the two states. In each cycle he can be only one or the other, applying 
either 45.31 or 45.32 as the case may be.

[45.33] Total War Production

            Soviet Production is now totally controlled by the Soviet 
Production rules. The number of Personnel and Arms Points added to pools 
each cycle depends on the number of operational Personnel and Arms 
Centers multiplied by the respective multiples.

[45.34] Soviet Arms Stockpiles

            The Soviet Player receives a stockpile of 60 Arms Points the 
first time he shifts from Peacetime to Limited War production. He 
receives an additional 60 Arms Points the first time he shifts from 
Limited War to Total War production. (The Soviet Player would receive a 
lump sum of 120 Arms Points if Russia shifted directly from Peacetime to 
Total War production). These are one-time awards.

[45.35] Movement of Arms and Training Centers

            During peacetime the Soviet Player may not move Arms Centers 
and Training Centers. During any given Cycle of Limited War, the Soviet 
Player may have only one Arms Center and one Training Center (each).

_45.35 (clarification) During any given turn of Limited War, the Soviet 
player may move only one Arms Center and one Training Center (each). _

[45.4] Soviet Production Multiples

            On the first cycle of Total War the Soviet Production 
Multiples begins to use these schedules.

*Cycle of*

*Total War*

*Personnel Multiple*

*Arms*

*Multiple*

1

3

1

2

2

1

3-18

1

1

19-24

1

2

25-27

2

2

28

2

3

29-31

1

3

even # 32-42

0

3

odd  # 33-43

1

3

44+

0

3

            These schedules are the same numbers as on the Soviet Cycle 
Record Track. Of course, in War in the East the game starts with Total 
War. In War In Europe, it will be rare that the first Total War Cycle 
coincides with 0/8/41.

Kent & Sue Haunschild wrote:
> Chuck,
>
> What I suddenly realized as I was replying to John earlier is that it 
> "has" to be difficult for the Soviet player to transition from Limited 
> War to Total War or the game gets broken.
>
> When the Soviet player Declares War on Germany he is under no 
> obligation to actually invade anywhere.  He merely gets another 60 
> Production points and moves from Peacetime Production to Limited War 
> Production.  It is now up to the German player to react.  If the 
> German player does nothing, the Soviet player has gained an enormous 
> advantage in terms of production.  In addition, the Soviet player is 
> now free to evacuate all his Arms Centers, move his TC's and disregard 
> any deployement requirements.
>
> If as you suggest the Soviets go to Total war as soon as the Axis 
> troops cross the border into Russia then then things really start to 
> come apart quickly.
>
> Kent
>
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