[WarInEur] Yugoslavian partisans - The Correct Ruling is DG

[Kent & Sue Haunschild]

If Yugoslavian units are eliminated by overruns (which has to be allowed by the evolution of the rules), then the number of Cadre and free deployment (placement) ) allowed by the subsequent WiE rules becomes impossibly generous.  How do we handle post-41 setups?

When playing from 39 most of the Yugoslavian units will be overrun and lost if we use the DG rules.  However, if we use the rules for Yugoslavian Partisan Cadre placement after 41 then a number of Cadre equal to the starting OOB will given.  In effect, this means that you only get the overrun effect if you start in 39 because the result is nullified by the later deploymnet instructions.

I think the KC errata was incorrect, its canonization as part of CWIE1 was a error, and the DG subsequent incorporation into their release a perpetuation of a mistake.

As I understand it, the DG rules are supposed to be "living" rules that would be changed as time brought oversites to light.  Does any one know who at DG is responsible or has authority to edit the living rules?

Kent





From: Don Lazov 
  To: Chuck Sutherland 
  Cc: ultrasoundimages at sbcglobal.net ; sgminfo ; warineur at mailman.halisp.net 
  Sent: Sunday, December 09, 2007 7:35 PM
  Subject: Re: [WarInEur] Yugoslavian partisans - The Correct Ruling is DG


  You guys are all right but mostly wrong!

  Actually the original SPI rules are some what vague, they only state Axis Action and then list Axis Combat and or Yugo Surrender. The KC errata further states that overruns do not cause Yugo Partisans. DG picks up on this ruling and does not allow Yugo partisans to be created due to overruns. Since the new DG rules trump everything else then we must abide by them (i.e., overruns do not cause Yogu Partisans to be created see below).

  SPI
  [31.51] Creation of Yugoslavian Cadres
  Whenever a Yugoslavian infantry division or cavalry division is eliminated by Axis action (either as a result of combat or because of the surrender of Yugoslavia), the counter is flipped over.

  KC Errata:
  .    [31.51] (Clarification) Yugoslavian units which are overrun, lost Forced Marching, or lost in a Yugoslavian attack on an Axis unit, do not become Partisan Cadres. 

  DG New Rules:

  [50.41] Creation of Yugoslavian Cadres

              Whenever a Yugoslavian infantry division or cavalry division is eliminated by Axis attacks or because of the surrender of Yugoslavia, the counter is flipped over in place to form a Yugoslavian Partisan Cadre. Yugoslavian units which are overrun, lost Forced Marching, or lost in a Yugoslavian attack on an Axis unit do not become Partisan Cadres.

  The original rules in War in the East 1st edition (for Soviet Partisans) lists any action could cause the possibility of Partisan creation.

  [28.0] OPTIONAL RULE: PARTISANS
  Only Russian infantry and cavalry units may attempt to become partisan cadres. Whenever a Russian infantry or cavalry unit is completely eliminated anywhere in Russia by any means other than a forced march attempt, the Russian Player rolls a die. If a "one" or a "two" is rolled (only), a partisan cadre is formed.

  Chuck Sutherland wrote: 
    Not allowing partisans because they were overrun makes for no logic at all, there is always going to be a remnant left in combat, otherwise there would have never been any soviet partisans because the germans were overrunning position after position historically. 

    It makes no sense! 


    sgminfo wrote: 

      ...and the other side of the coin is this... 

      Given that the cadres form the basis of the later partisan war...do we want to create a system, or game play style, that effectively cuts out the partisan war, given that ITRW the protagonists, NOT blessed with 100% perfect hindsight, were singularly incapable of preventing this situation. 

      If you think about this, perfect hindsight in this manner, would render the simulation of the Iraq situation all but impossible. Either one accepts the warts and works with the flow of the simulation, or one chooses to break the model. The question is, is that decision, a decision that the player could take, but still claim he is acting reasonably, as a field commander, in the game. 


      -|steve|- 
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